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	<title>Comments on: Thinking lazily about reputation and relationships</title>
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	<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/</link>
	<description>a blog about information</description>
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		<title>By: A Freemium Life &#124; Unstructured Thoughts by Taylor Davidson</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-485317</link>
		<dc:creator>A Freemium Life &#124; Unstructured Thoughts by Taylor Davidson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Feb 2009 17:30:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-485317</guid>
		<description>[...] happens if you &#8220;capitalize&#8221; your relationship and reputation networks? Can you become a &#8220;Pareto node&#8221;? John Hagel, Pareto Power and Leveraged Growth: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] happens if you &#8220;capitalize&#8221; your relationship and reputation networks? Can you become a &#8220;Pareto node&#8221;? John Hagel, Pareto Power and Leveraged Growth: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Shannon Paul</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-439766</link>
		<dc:creator>Shannon Paul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 11 Nov 2008 14:38:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-439766</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m sorry it took me so long to respond to this post. I think this is a really fascinating approach and I love that you titled it &quot;Thinking lazily...&quot; 

I remember reading a collection of short stories by a female Bengali author named Bharati Mukherjee. Through a collection of short stories, she illustrated the tensions in relationships that were a result of cultural differences. One major takeaway I remember was that Americans are often seen as *emotionally lazy*. That much of the world&#039;s criticism about our culture is that even our most intimate relationships are, at their core, transactional.

I think it&#039;s such an interesting and profound observation to make that social media could be bringing humanity into our transactions. It may even be ironic that technology is enabling this humanity to take a precedence. 

I hope you&#039;re right. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m sorry it took me so long to respond to this post. I think this is a really fascinating approach and I love that you titled it &#8220;Thinking lazily&#8230;&#8221; </p>
<p>I remember reading a collection of short stories by a female Bengali author named Bharati Mukherjee. Through a collection of short stories, she illustrated the tensions in relationships that were a result of cultural differences. One major takeaway I remember was that Americans are often seen as *emotionally lazy*. That much of the world&#8217;s criticism about our culture is that even our most intimate relationships are, at their core, transactional.</p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s such an interesting and profound observation to make that social media could be bringing humanity into our transactions. It may even be ironic that technology is enabling this humanity to take a precedence. </p>
<p>I hope you&#8217;re right. :)</p>
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		<title>By: Recent Links on Ma.gnolia at Fast Wonder Blog: Consulting, Online Communities, and Social Media</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-439090</link>
		<dc:creator>Recent Links on Ma.gnolia at Fast Wonder Blog: Consulting, Online Communities, and Social Media</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 08 Nov 2008 07:50:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-439090</guid>
		<description>[...] Thinking lazily about reputation and relationships [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Thinking lazily about reputation and relationships [...]</p>
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		<title>By: JP</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-437842</link>
		<dc:creator>JP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 23:30:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-437842</guid>
		<description>@kevin thanks for your comments and for the link. Your post triggered some other thoughts, as did some of the other comments, and I will try and follow up soon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@kevin thanks for your comments and for the link. Your post triggered some other thoughts, as did some of the other comments, and I will try and follow up soon.</p>
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		<title>By: Kevin Magee</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-437755</link>
		<dc:creator>Kevin Magee</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 18:24:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-437755</guid>
		<description>JP, really interesting thoughts and some great comments above. It sparked a fantastic conversation I had with some people recently. I recount it here (http://inchpebbles.blogspot.com/2008/11/business-relationships.html) and give you a mention!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JP, really interesting thoughts and some great comments above. It sparked a fantastic conversation I had with some people recently. I recount it here (<a href="http://inchpebbles.blogspot.com/2008/11/business-relationships.html" rel="nofollow">http://inchpebbles.blogspot.com/2008/11/business-relationships.html</a>) and give you a mention!</p>
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		<title>By: JP</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-437621</link>
		<dc:creator>JP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 10:16:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-437621</guid>
		<description>@norwin :-) there&#039;s a whole pile of people out there who could do themselves a lot of good by just going out and buying Cluetrain!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@norwin :-) there&#8217;s a whole pile of people out there who could do themselves a lot of good by just going out and buying Cluetrain!</p>
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		<title>By: Norwin</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-437617</link>
		<dc:creator>Norwin</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 03 Nov 2008 09:36:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-437617</guid>
		<description>You were very nearly quoted this morning by an economist on BBC Radio 4&#039;s &quot;Start the week&quot; programme, who observed that part of the world&#039;s current financial problems stem from the fact that the relationships between debtors and creditors, previously mediated by banks in a fairly close way, had become stretched and spread out by so many intermediaries that they were now purely transactional. Conversations between people, with known reputations, probably made lending money a much safer business not very long ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You were very nearly quoted this morning by an economist on BBC Radio 4&#8242;s &#8220;Start the week&#8221; programme, who observed that part of the world&#8217;s current financial problems stem from the fact that the relationships between debtors and creditors, previously mediated by banks in a fairly close way, had become stretched and spread out by so many intermediaries that they were now purely transactional. Conversations between people, with known reputations, probably made lending money a much safer business not very long ago.</p>
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		<title>By: JP</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-435919</link>
		<dc:creator>JP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 19:27:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-435919</guid>
		<description>I was thinking lazily, yes, but I wanted to make three points. And I made them badly.

one was to distinguish between eastern and western concepts of reputation. which I think i did OK at.

the second was to argue that reputation and relationship *should be* deeply intertwined, that one depended on the other. I think i did a bad job of portraying this point.

the third was to argue that what had happened in the west was that people managed somehow to separate reputation and relationship. And this I couldn&#039;t even understand. this point I made an awful job of.

so I will write a follow-up post and concentrate on that last point. sometime. sometime soon

you make good points, thanks for stopping by.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was thinking lazily, yes, but I wanted to make three points. And I made them badly.</p>
<p>one was to distinguish between eastern and western concepts of reputation. which I think i did OK at.</p>
<p>the second was to argue that reputation and relationship *should be* deeply intertwined, that one depended on the other. I think i did a bad job of portraying this point.</p>
<p>the third was to argue that what had happened in the west was that people managed somehow to separate reputation and relationship. And this I couldn&#8217;t even understand. this point I made an awful job of.</p>
<p>so I will write a follow-up post and concentrate on that last point. sometime. sometime soon</p>
<p>you make good points, thanks for stopping by.</p>
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		<title>By: Scott</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2008/10/27/thinking-lazily-about-reputation-and-relationships/comment-page-1/#comment-435913</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Oct 2008 18:59:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1384#comment-435913</guid>
		<description>In fairness, you did say you were &quot;Thinking lazily,&quot; so maybe that accounts for some potentially unconnected dots.  : )  I will just as lazily try to confuse things further.

The premise seems to be that relationships are more important then reputations. But, as you properly - in my opinion - point out, &quot;Reputation is deeply intertwined with relationship, reputation is an embodiment of what your relationships say about you.&quot; (And in any case, I&#039;m not sure what abundance vs. scarcity has to do in leading to the conclusion.)

So... if reputation almost by definition precedes a relationship - or later impinges upon one&#039;s perspective of a relationship - how is that archaic? For a moment, I&#039;ll go back to the original quote... “the word “reputation” is so 1990. today it’s all about relationships”

For starters, the fact that reputation became and remains a buzzy thing doesn&#039;t mean relationships were any less important though the 90s. And just because more people are discovering social networks as a buzzy thing, (even though social nets  pre-dated any form of online communication anyway), doesn&#039;t make reputation passe.

My lazily reached point? The particular buzzword that punditry seems to bemuse itself with pontificating upon as the Web 2.3457 think du jour doesn&#039;t mean that there&#039;s any real fire amidst the smoke. Or even if there is, it doesn&#039;t mean that one has to or should declare something of importance dead simply because it was overhyped as hype.

Outside the context of hierarchy or accident of geography or similar, relationships are generally by choice and somewhat purposeful. And either way, while it may be interesting for definitions and thought experiments to separate them, it&#039;s rather foolish to discard declare something passe when it it is inextricably intertwined with the very thing you&#039;re now saying is the next thing.

In terms of the reputation services being more about the bad then the good; how are these not the same thing? Good/bad, half full/half empty is a matter of perspective. One could argue - perhaps weakly - that every marketing list sold is a list of &quot;good&quot; prospects for a product or service.

Lastly, I&#039;m all for your take on East vs. West in terms of seeming desirous of onymous sources. Our modern, mobile society can make that difficult. Sociologist Amitai Etzioni - in for example, The Limits of Privacy - discusses how some of this has come about. But suffice it to say, it&#039;s related to the need for third party reputation management in a world where transactions happen with individuals&#039; far outside their tribe. So it might not be true that &quot;Your reputation precedes you,&quot; but... others can maybe check later if they feel the need.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In fairness, you did say you were &#8220;Thinking lazily,&#8221; so maybe that accounts for some potentially unconnected dots.  : )  I will just as lazily try to confuse things further.</p>
<p>The premise seems to be that relationships are more important then reputations. But, as you properly &#8211; in my opinion &#8211; point out, &#8220;Reputation is deeply intertwined with relationship, reputation is an embodiment of what your relationships say about you.&#8221; (And in any case, I&#8217;m not sure what abundance vs. scarcity has to do in leading to the conclusion.)</p>
<p>So&#8230; if reputation almost by definition precedes a relationship &#8211; or later impinges upon one&#8217;s perspective of a relationship &#8211; how is that archaic? For a moment, I&#8217;ll go back to the original quote&#8230; “the word “reputation” is so 1990. today it’s all about relationships”</p>
<p>For starters, the fact that reputation became and remains a buzzy thing doesn&#8217;t mean relationships were any less important though the 90s. And just because more people are discovering social networks as a buzzy thing, (even though social nets  pre-dated any form of online communication anyway), doesn&#8217;t make reputation passe.</p>
<p>My lazily reached point? The particular buzzword that punditry seems to bemuse itself with pontificating upon as the Web 2.3457 think du jour doesn&#8217;t mean that there&#8217;s any real fire amidst the smoke. Or even if there is, it doesn&#8217;t mean that one has to or should declare something of importance dead simply because it was overhyped as hype.</p>
<p>Outside the context of hierarchy or accident of geography or similar, relationships are generally by choice and somewhat purposeful. And either way, while it may be interesting for definitions and thought experiments to separate them, it&#8217;s rather foolish to discard declare something passe when it it is inextricably intertwined with the very thing you&#8217;re now saying is the next thing.</p>
<p>In terms of the reputation services being more about the bad then the good; how are these not the same thing? Good/bad, half full/half empty is a matter of perspective. One could argue &#8211; perhaps weakly &#8211; that every marketing list sold is a list of &#8220;good&#8221; prospects for a product or service.</p>
<p>Lastly, I&#8217;m all for your take on East vs. West in terms of seeming desirous of onymous sources. Our modern, mobile society can make that difficult. Sociologist Amitai Etzioni &#8211; in for example, The Limits of Privacy &#8211; discusses how some of this has come about. But suffice it to say, it&#8217;s related to the need for third party reputation management in a world where transactions happen with individuals&#8217; far outside their tribe. So it might not be true that &#8220;Your reputation precedes you,&#8221; but&#8230; others can maybe check later if they feel the need.</p>
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