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	<title>Comments on: Of followers and followees and friends</title>
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	<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/</link>
	<description>a blog about information</description>
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		<title>By: The 10 new laws of Cyberspace - Social Networks</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-469213</link>
		<dc:creator>The 10 new laws of Cyberspace - Social Networks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:50:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-469213</guid>
		<description>[...] number, named after British anthropologist Robin Dunbar. Curiously, BT&#8217;s innovation head JP Rangaswami thinks social software might help raise the Dunbar [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] number, named after British anthropologist Robin Dunbar. Curiously, BT&#8217;s innovation head JP Rangaswami thinks social software might help raise the Dunbar [...]</p>
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		<title>By: jose del moral</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-469211</link>
		<dc:creator>jose del moral</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:49:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-469211</guid>
		<description>Good remark. I also think social software should raise the Dunbar number, but will also hurt the quality of relationships.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good remark. I also think social software should raise the Dunbar number, but will also hurt the quality of relationships.</p>
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		<title>By: Mayank Dhingra</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-467451</link>
		<dc:creator>Mayank Dhingra</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 11:49:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-467451</guid>
		<description>Despite all the action that&#039;s happening on the internet, I am not really sure if we&#039;d be bypassing the Dunbar limit any soon.  Because time at hand will always be a constraint. It also depends on your definition of friend. Can you count someone whom you actively conversed(@&#039;d) a while back but now don&#039;t  as a friend? 

I&#039;d like to take Dunbar&#039;s number(~150) as the number of active parallel connections you have have over a given(and small) period of time. So while by the definition of 2 @ for a friend definition I might have a couple of hundreds or even more friends, over a given period of time I would be actively interacting with about 150 people only. Without realizing I might be talking to newer people and loosing touch with some older one&#039;s(not all of them obviously), who also similarly would be making connections with new people, forgetting old one&#039;s like me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Despite all the action that&#8217;s happening on the internet, I am not really sure if we&#8217;d be bypassing the Dunbar limit any soon.  Because time at hand will always be a constraint. It also depends on your definition of friend. Can you count someone whom you actively conversed(@&#8217;d) a while back but now don&#8217;t  as a friend? </p>
<p>I&#8217;d like to take Dunbar&#8217;s number(~150) as the number of active parallel connections you have have over a given(and small) period of time. So while by the definition of 2 @ for a friend definition I might have a couple of hundreds or even more friends, over a given period of time I would be actively interacting with about 150 people only. Without realizing I might be talking to newer people and loosing touch with some older one&#8217;s(not all of them obviously), who also similarly would be making connections with new people, forgetting old one&#8217;s like me.</p>
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		<title>By: Twitter Friends and the Influence of Influentials in Word of Mouth Marketing &#171; Skilful Minds</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-467037</link>
		<dc:creator>Twitter Friends and the Influence of Influentials in Word of Mouth Marketing &#171; Skilful Minds</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 02:06:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-467037</guid>
		<description>[...] Rangaswami over at Confused of Calcutta offered the observation that the HP study&#8217;s findings probably ought not surprise us. The [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Rangaswami over at Confused of Calcutta offered the observation that the HP study&#8217;s findings probably ought not surprise us. The [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rednod &#187; What makes you unfollow someone? Six things stand out.</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-466210</link>
		<dc:creator>Rednod &#187; What makes you unfollow someone? Six things stand out.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 14 Jan 2009 16:04:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-466210</guid>
		<description>[...] humans can normally handle around 150 social relationships then, as JP Rangaswami observes, tools like Twitter help push this limit up to perhaps 600 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] humans can normally handle around 150 social relationships then, as JP Rangaswami observes, tools like Twitter help push this limit up to perhaps 600 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Benjamin M J Ellis</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-465472</link>
		<dc:creator>Benjamin M J Ellis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 09:32:54 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-465472</guid>
		<description>JP, your unch is safe, fear not!

One needs to be careful of mean averages in studying social networks. Figure 4 is slightly misleading if taken at face value, in that it hides the bifurcation of twitter user types. There are many following 1,000&#039;s followed by very few (&#039;spammers&#039; for want of a better word), and many followed by 1,000&#039;s who follow 1000&#039;. That is obscured by the average.

Figure 6 (the first graph) should roll off if the second graph were to represent the median, but it doesn&#039;t, so there is an anomaly in the study there. Figure 6 is the one which really tells you if the &#039;Dunbar Number&#039; is growing or not. It is still thought provoking though!

With regards to Dunbar&#039;s number more generally, it is worth remembering that it isn&#039;t a hard limit (Dunbar drew his stats from averages, not maximums) - see more in my post here:  &lt;a href=&quot;http://redcatco.com/blog/communication/dunbars-number-groups-language-and-social-media/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Dunbar&#039;s number = groups language and social media&lt;/a&gt;. It seems, rather than moving the number, social media might actually be shifting what we mean by &#039;friend&#039;. I&#039;m not sure if that is a good thing, but increased communication generally is, so hopefully it will all work out!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JP, your unch is safe, fear not!</p>
<p>One needs to be careful of mean averages in studying social networks. Figure 4 is slightly misleading if taken at face value, in that it hides the bifurcation of twitter user types. There are many following 1,000&#8242;s followed by very few (&#8216;spammers&#8217; for want of a better word), and many followed by 1,000&#8242;s who follow 1000&#8242;. That is obscured by the average.</p>
<p>Figure 6 (the first graph) should roll off if the second graph were to represent the median, but it doesn&#8217;t, so there is an anomaly in the study there. Figure 6 is the one which really tells you if the &#8216;Dunbar Number&#8217; is growing or not. It is still thought provoking though!</p>
<p>With regards to Dunbar&#8217;s number more generally, it is worth remembering that it isn&#8217;t a hard limit (Dunbar drew his stats from averages, not maximums) &#8211; see more in my post here:  <a href="http://redcatco.com/blog/communication/dunbars-number-groups-language-and-social-media/" rel="nofollow">Dunbar&#8217;s number = groups language and social media</a>. It seems, rather than moving the number, social media might actually be shifting what we mean by &#8216;friend&#8217;. I&#8217;m not sure if that is a good thing, but increased communication generally is, so hopefully it will all work out!</p>
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		<title>By: Enterprise Architecture in Higher Education &#187; The Evolution of my Global Network</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-465379</link>
		<dc:creator>Enterprise Architecture in Higher Education &#187; The Evolution of my Global Network</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 13 Jan 2009 06:19:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-465379</guid>
		<description>[...] He said &#8220;Twitter what is that?&#8221;  I did a quick overview of Twitter which reminded me of a good post by JP Rangaswami. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] He said &#8220;Twitter what is that?&#8221;  I did a quick overview of Twitter which reminded me of a good post by JP Rangaswami. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Atul</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-464384</link>
		<dc:creator>Atul</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:19:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-464384</guid>
		<description>JP,

This is the kind of post that makes one think, analyze and wonder. 

First off, the analysis between # of followers, followees (for lack of a better word) and &#039;friends&#039; is excellent. However, I think the definition of a &#039;friend&#039; could be revised upwards. 

Regardless of how one defines a &#039;friend&#039; on twitter, the trend remains true that as Internet makes terribly easy conversation/communication across boundaries, one&#039;s friend-number would rise.  It is indeed interesting that you think that a Dunbar limit (~150)  becomes apparent. 
I think it is because *social norms* evolve much more slowly than *technological tools*.  Twitter and such tools are largely the domain of the digirati today; these are the early adopters. The mass public still hasn&#039;t adopted these. The norms for usage, communication with  social internet tools, etc. will continue to evolve slowly. 
It perhaps won&#039;t be until a few years (5? 10?) before we will see any significant increase (10%? more?) in the Dunbar limit.

My 2 naya paisa :-)


Great post.
-a</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JP,</p>
<p>This is the kind of post that makes one think, analyze and wonder. </p>
<p>First off, the analysis between # of followers, followees (for lack of a better word) and &#8216;friends&#8217; is excellent. However, I think the definition of a &#8216;friend&#8217; could be revised upwards. </p>
<p>Regardless of how one defines a &#8216;friend&#8217; on twitter, the trend remains true that as Internet makes terribly easy conversation/communication across boundaries, one&#8217;s friend-number would rise.  It is indeed interesting that you think that a Dunbar limit (~150)  becomes apparent.<br />
I think it is because *social norms* evolve much more slowly than *technological tools*.  Twitter and such tools are largely the domain of the digirati today; these are the early adopters. The mass public still hasn&#8217;t adopted these. The norms for usage, communication with  social internet tools, etc. will continue to evolve slowly.<br />
It perhaps won&#8217;t be until a few years (5? 10?) before we will see any significant increase (10%? more?) in the Dunbar limit.</p>
<p>My 2 naya paisa :-)</p>
<p>Great post.<br />
-a</p>
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		<title>By: Social media is not media, it&#8217;s social / we are social</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-464383</link>
		<dc:creator>Social media is not media, it&#8217;s social / we are social</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Jan 2009 18:18:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-464383</guid>
		<description>[...] We&#8217;re not ready to throw away awareness, consideration and recommendation as objectives and measures just yet, but we do agree with his main message - we are inherently social, and social media just let&#8217;s us be social in new and different ways (even if we&#8217;re still restricted by Dunbar&#8217;s number). [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] We&#8217;re not ready to throw away awareness, consideration and recommendation as objectives and measures just yet, but we do agree with his main message &#8211; we are inherently social, and social media just let&#8217;s us be social in new and different ways (even if we&#8217;re still restricted by Dunbar&#8217;s number). [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Rachel Happe</title>
		<link>http://confusedofcalcutta.com/2009/01/11/of-followers-and-followees-and-friends/comment-page-1/#comment-464319</link>
		<dc:creator>Rachel Happe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Jan 2009 14:52:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://confusedofcalcutta.com/?p=1534#comment-464319</guid>
		<description>JP - Interesting report.  I think that there may be something that the report is not accounting for the time it takes for the mass market to learn how to effectively use new tools.

Like many things I look at my own experience for guidance in doing a gut check on this type of thing and I agree with you.  These numbers do not reflect my experience with Twitter. I did a quick review my my @ messages and DMs over the last couple of weeks and it is over 70+ people out of a network of around 1400.  I feel like I&#039;ve been able to maintain more relationships with more people than I ever could before.   Are they different types of relationships? Absolutely but they also provide much more value then the huge Rolodex that sites, mostly unused in Outlook.

Maybe I&#039;m an outlier but I think it&#039;s just a matter of learning how to effectively use the new tools.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JP &#8211; Interesting report.  I think that there may be something that the report is not accounting for the time it takes for the mass market to learn how to effectively use new tools.</p>
<p>Like many things I look at my own experience for guidance in doing a gut check on this type of thing and I agree with you.  These numbers do not reflect my experience with Twitter. I did a quick review my my @ messages and DMs over the last couple of weeks and it is over 70+ people out of a network of around 1400.  I feel like I&#8217;ve been able to maintain more relationships with more people than I ever could before.   Are they different types of relationships? Absolutely but they also provide much more value then the huge Rolodex that sites, mostly unused in Outlook.</p>
<p>Maybe I&#8217;m an outlier but I think it&#8217;s just a matter of learning how to effectively use the new tools.</p>
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